Deathly Hallows...the valis opinion
Jul. 21st, 2007 04:55 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
valis2Yeah, like you were all waiting on pins and needles for my thoughts. *grins*
Warning: written at 4:30 am. Probably incoherent.
My first opinion? This book was written for casual fans, and intermediate fans. It was not written for hard-core fans like us, my friends. She does put a few things in each book for us, I think, but it is very obvious who her intended targets are, and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that. It's just an observation.
My personal opinion? This book has divided me so utterly I almost don't know what to say. On one hand, I love so many things about it; on the other hand, I'm so upset about so many things about it. I still wish we'd had another year before book 7.
Ron was love, first of all.
And the wizarding fairy tale? So. Much. Love. In fact, about a year ago I tortured![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
julian_black at length about wizarding fairy tales, and what they'd be like, so I nearly went through the roof about the Hallows tale. It was fantastic, and I adored Ron telling Harry and Hermione other titles...I laughed so hard!
I was absolutely enthralled by the departure from Privet Drive. It was so action-filled, so completely edge-of-the-seat cool, that I was nearly falling off the couch. Incredible.
Luna, and the portraits! That made my breath catch in my throat. I always enjoyed her as a character, and I was so happy that she had some time in the book.
And the sword in the lake scene, with the fantastic Ron-slaying-the-Horcrux bit? WOW. Just wonderful. The darkness of it, the horror of it, the courage it must have taken...
Godric's Hollow was so...bittersweet, so full of sorrow, and then the horror set in and it was quite frightening.
And Grindelwald!! I was so excited that he was in the book, that was awesome. I always thought it would be awesome to have them dueling, with Grindelwald left in the dirt, looking up at Voldemort, realizing that his time was up.
The ending battle was pretty cool.
Neville with the sword was a phenomenal conclusion to his storyline. I loved how he was transformed by the difficulties of Hogwarts; he was forged by the ill treatment of the Carrows, and I was happy that he pulled the sword out of the hat...though I am still a bit worried about what happens when the goblins realize it's gone.
scarah2 was the first person I saw pushing the Scarcrux theory, which really made sense, and she was definitely right about that. There were so many things I read that matched fanfics I've read, and so many guesses fans made that were right. I had a feeling that Dumbledore wouldn't use an Unbreakable Vow with Snape, that it would be the Lily!lurve that made him do it, and that was true. Also, hooray for trickofthedark, and her fantastic illustrated series where Dudley is a real character and falls for Hermione...I was thinking of her story as I read the better-behaved!Dudley scenes.
There was one scene that really seemed...real to me, for some reason. When Rufus shows up to Harry's birthday dinner, Remus and Tonks jump the fence, and I just sat there, holding the book, and I could picture it so vividly, and it seemed so--real. It sounds silly, but it really affected me.
And Hermione's parents. Wow. Wow. Wow. Just the idea that she wasn't going back for her N.E.W.T.S. was astounding, that she was following Harry instead of her education, but then...her parents. I was absolutely shocked.
I nearly died when I read the wedding chapter, and Kingsley made that incredible, ominous warning about the Ministry having fallen. I got goosebumps.
Things I was surprised didn't happen? I was all expecting a Moody!Zombie, which would have been pretty cool, heh. I was expecting that Ron would use the Delumiwhatsit while thinking of Dumbledore, and it would lead him to whomever was the "eye." I was wondering if Lupin was possessed by an Imperius Curse.
I was spoiled by a troll, so I knew that Tonks was going to die, but I was shocked and absolutely horrified to find that Lupin died as well. Really, that was just awful. I am still terribly saddened by his story (his overall story), and I'm a little confused about the altercation between him and Harry; it seemed very weird and offputting.
I was rather confused by the contradictory Secret Keeper things, compared to what she said on the website or in an interview.
The lengthy camping interludes nearly made me mental. Yes, I totally understand that they were meant to put the Trio through fire in the most awful way--by isolating them and forcing them to work together...but still, I was definitely getting tired of them going through amazing moments and then...back to the tent, over and over again. Hermione reminds me of when I used to think about going on adventures as a kid; I'm a control freak, so I kept adding things to take, and then I'd need a Bag of Holding, and it would just get crazier and crazier until (in my head) I'd be just about dragging around an entire townhouse.
Snupin, my favorite pairing...wow. What a blow. Both gone. Now I know what some of you will say, you will point the finger at signs to say that Snape is still alive, but at my...er..."canon core" I just know he's dead.
Did anything happen to Umbridge? What was the resolution of her story...did I miss it? I was floored by how incredibly evil she was on the return trip, too. I was even more floored by how quickly Voldemort took over and established his Voldereich.
And WTF?! with Peter showing up and then strangling himself a paragraph later? I mean, seriously! And then Dobby shows up and dies a scene later. I mean, I'm all for tying up loose ends, but wow, those were pretty extreme measures.
The worst part of the story for me was the ending. I truly expected some sort of unity to occur, whether between the magical races or, at the very least, the houses. I mean, the Sorting Hat was imploring them to join together, and yet...not only did we not have unification, we ended up with the worst possible scenario: the final vilification of the Slytherins. I was horrified that not one Slytherin joined in the fight against the Dark Lord. And also, much worse, was the Dumbledore comment that translated to Snape should have been in Gryffindor, which was the last straw for me on that topic, seriously. Snape was very brave, of course, but also...he was still Slytherin. Cunning. Smart. To write off the good efforts of Snape as being because he was rilly rilly Gryffy at heart made me so angry. So much for the houses working together.
Part of this scenario was the non-redemption of Draco Malfoy, which also horrified me. In the beginning chapter, he seemed to actually be worried, and fearful; but in the storage room, we have the "classic" Draco, all bluster and scorn, and I was astonished that he'd gone back to flat character again. (There is a lit theory about characters; characters who change and grow are "round" characters, and they're surrounded by unchanging characters, or "flat" characters.) I've never seen a character grow and change, and then go back to their original characterization again. Even more awful was the bit of slapstick involved. It was as if she thought, oh yeah, kids read this, better put a funny slip-and-fall routine in, har har.
It's a surprising message...that some kids are just "bad," and that you can't change them, so you just put them in their own selfish naughty house and wipe your hands clean of them. Maybe I'm just reading too much into it, though.
Snape's death was not completely unsurprising; it actually bothered me much, much less than Lupin's death. I had always felt that Snape might die in some sort of noble, redemptive way, and even though it wasn't particularly noble, I still found it much less disturbing than poor, poor Remus. I have to admit that I was suspicious, after he mentioned that the son's name was Ted Remus Lupin. I thought, that's strange, why is his middle name Remus? Of course, because she was going to kill him and needed a minature Lupin to take away the sting. Ugh.
While I was reading Snape's death scene, I found it odd that he wanted Harry to look at him; I really thought that Legilimency would be involved. Too much fanfic, I fear. Anyway, later, when I was thinking about it, the realization came to me like a bolt from the blue; he wanted to see her eyes one last time. I cried then.
Was it too much to ask for a funeral for him? A bit of closure? I'm still broken up about that; here she took all of this time to make this great character, and then...nothing. And when I think how difficult his life was, alone, and completely isolated in the end...it makes me feel so very sad for him.
All in all, I foresee a lot of sadness in the hardcore!fandom. And a lot of AU fics. I don't think that fandom is destroyed, of course; I just think that we'll all be in shock for awhile, and some people will probably leave, and I'm just very sad about this.
I wish we could have had a different ending.
We'll just have to write one ourselves, like we always do. *hugs*
Warning: written at 4:30 am. Probably incoherent.
My first opinion? This book was written for casual fans, and intermediate fans. It was not written for hard-core fans like us, my friends. She does put a few things in each book for us, I think, but it is very obvious who her intended targets are, and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that. It's just an observation.
My personal opinion? This book has divided me so utterly I almost don't know what to say. On one hand, I love so many things about it; on the other hand, I'm so upset about so many things about it. I still wish we'd had another year before book 7.
Ron was love, first of all.
And the wizarding fairy tale? So. Much. Love. In fact, about a year ago I tortured
julian_black at length about wizarding fairy tales, and what they'd be like, so I nearly went through the roof about the Hallows tale. It was fantastic, and I adored Ron telling Harry and Hermione other titles...I laughed so hard!I was absolutely enthralled by the departure from Privet Drive. It was so action-filled, so completely edge-of-the-seat cool, that I was nearly falling off the couch. Incredible.
Luna, and the portraits! That made my breath catch in my throat. I always enjoyed her as a character, and I was so happy that she had some time in the book.
And the sword in the lake scene, with the fantastic Ron-slaying-the-Horcrux bit? WOW. Just wonderful. The darkness of it, the horror of it, the courage it must have taken...
Godric's Hollow was so...bittersweet, so full of sorrow, and then the horror set in and it was quite frightening.
And Grindelwald!! I was so excited that he was in the book, that was awesome. I always thought it would be awesome to have them dueling, with Grindelwald left in the dirt, looking up at Voldemort, realizing that his time was up.
The ending battle was pretty cool.
Neville with the sword was a phenomenal conclusion to his storyline. I loved how he was transformed by the difficulties of Hogwarts; he was forged by the ill treatment of the Carrows, and I was happy that he pulled the sword out of the hat...though I am still a bit worried about what happens when the goblins realize it's gone.
scarah2 was the first person I saw pushing the Scarcrux theory, which really made sense, and she was definitely right about that. There were so many things I read that matched fanfics I've read, and so many guesses fans made that were right. I had a feeling that Dumbledore wouldn't use an Unbreakable Vow with Snape, that it would be the Lily!lurve that made him do it, and that was true. Also, hooray for trickofthedark, and her fantastic illustrated series where Dudley is a real character and falls for Hermione...I was thinking of her story as I read the better-behaved!Dudley scenes.There was one scene that really seemed...real to me, for some reason. When Rufus shows up to Harry's birthday dinner, Remus and Tonks jump the fence, and I just sat there, holding the book, and I could picture it so vividly, and it seemed so--real. It sounds silly, but it really affected me.
And Hermione's parents. Wow. Wow. Wow. Just the idea that she wasn't going back for her N.E.W.T.S. was astounding, that she was following Harry instead of her education, but then...her parents. I was absolutely shocked.
I nearly died when I read the wedding chapter, and Kingsley made that incredible, ominous warning about the Ministry having fallen. I got goosebumps.
Things I was surprised didn't happen? I was all expecting a Moody!Zombie, which would have been pretty cool, heh. I was expecting that Ron would use the Delumiwhatsit while thinking of Dumbledore, and it would lead him to whomever was the "eye." I was wondering if Lupin was possessed by an Imperius Curse.
I was spoiled by a troll, so I knew that Tonks was going to die, but I was shocked and absolutely horrified to find that Lupin died as well. Really, that was just awful. I am still terribly saddened by his story (his overall story), and I'm a little confused about the altercation between him and Harry; it seemed very weird and offputting.
I was rather confused by the contradictory Secret Keeper things, compared to what she said on the website or in an interview.
The lengthy camping interludes nearly made me mental. Yes, I totally understand that they were meant to put the Trio through fire in the most awful way--by isolating them and forcing them to work together...but still, I was definitely getting tired of them going through amazing moments and then...back to the tent, over and over again. Hermione reminds me of when I used to think about going on adventures as a kid; I'm a control freak, so I kept adding things to take, and then I'd need a Bag of Holding, and it would just get crazier and crazier until (in my head) I'd be just about dragging around an entire townhouse.
Snupin, my favorite pairing...wow. What a blow. Both gone. Now I know what some of you will say, you will point the finger at signs to say that Snape is still alive, but at my...er..."canon core" I just know he's dead.
Did anything happen to Umbridge? What was the resolution of her story...did I miss it? I was floored by how incredibly evil she was on the return trip, too. I was even more floored by how quickly Voldemort took over and established his Voldereich.
And WTF?! with Peter showing up and then strangling himself a paragraph later? I mean, seriously! And then Dobby shows up and dies a scene later. I mean, I'm all for tying up loose ends, but wow, those were pretty extreme measures.
The worst part of the story for me was the ending. I truly expected some sort of unity to occur, whether between the magical races or, at the very least, the houses. I mean, the Sorting Hat was imploring them to join together, and yet...not only did we not have unification, we ended up with the worst possible scenario: the final vilification of the Slytherins. I was horrified that not one Slytherin joined in the fight against the Dark Lord. And also, much worse, was the Dumbledore comment that translated to Snape should have been in Gryffindor, which was the last straw for me on that topic, seriously. Snape was very brave, of course, but also...he was still Slytherin. Cunning. Smart. To write off the good efforts of Snape as being because he was rilly rilly Gryffy at heart made me so angry. So much for the houses working together.
Part of this scenario was the non-redemption of Draco Malfoy, which also horrified me. In the beginning chapter, he seemed to actually be worried, and fearful; but in the storage room, we have the "classic" Draco, all bluster and scorn, and I was astonished that he'd gone back to flat character again. (There is a lit theory about characters; characters who change and grow are "round" characters, and they're surrounded by unchanging characters, or "flat" characters.) I've never seen a character grow and change, and then go back to their original characterization again. Even more awful was the bit of slapstick involved. It was as if she thought, oh yeah, kids read this, better put a funny slip-and-fall routine in, har har.
It's a surprising message...that some kids are just "bad," and that you can't change them, so you just put them in their own selfish naughty house and wipe your hands clean of them. Maybe I'm just reading too much into it, though.
Snape's death was not completely unsurprising; it actually bothered me much, much less than Lupin's death. I had always felt that Snape might die in some sort of noble, redemptive way, and even though it wasn't particularly noble, I still found it much less disturbing than poor, poor Remus. I have to admit that I was suspicious, after he mentioned that the son's name was Ted Remus Lupin. I thought, that's strange, why is his middle name Remus? Of course, because she was going to kill him and needed a minature Lupin to take away the sting. Ugh.
While I was reading Snape's death scene, I found it odd that he wanted Harry to look at him; I really thought that Legilimency would be involved. Too much fanfic, I fear. Anyway, later, when I was thinking about it, the realization came to me like a bolt from the blue; he wanted to see her eyes one last time. I cried then.
Was it too much to ask for a funeral for him? A bit of closure? I'm still broken up about that; here she took all of this time to make this great character, and then...nothing. And when I think how difficult his life was, alone, and completely isolated in the end...it makes me feel so very sad for him.
All in all, I foresee a lot of sadness in the hardcore!fandom. And a lot of AU fics. I don't think that fandom is destroyed, of course; I just think that we'll all be in shock for awhile, and some people will probably leave, and I'm just very sad about this.
I wish we could have had a different ending.
We'll just have to write one ourselves, like we always do. *hugs*
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 09:07 am (UTC)It was fantastic, and I adored Ron telling Harry and Hermione other titles...I laughed so hard!
One thing I really missed in Books 5 and 6 was Ron being a repository of information about the Wizarding World that Harry and Hermione couldn't possibly know, because they hadn't grown up in it. I think Rowling kind of forgot about it, but it was back in full force in this book, and boy did I love it.
I think Ron's return in "The Silver Doe" is one of the best pieces of writing she's ever done.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 09:17 am (UTC)Harry goes from "Snape is evil" to "Snape is totally good since he stalked my mom creepily" in about two seconds. WTF.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 09:34 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 09:43 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 09:56 am (UTC)If she could say that Grindelwald was dead, and then have him all of a sudden alive and well ... No body, no portrait, no funeral, no ghost. Bezoar! (I will cling to this theory until I am dead.)
And also, much worse, was the Dumbledore comment that translated to Snape should have been in Gryffindor, which was the last straw for me on that topic, seriously. Snape was very brave, of course, but also...he was still Slytherin. Cunning. Smart. To write off the good efforts of Snape as being because he was rilly rilly Gryffy at heart made me so angry.
This really pissed me off, too. More character rape and Slytherin bashing, as if there isn't enough of the latter in the first 1-6 books. Enough. Who wants to be in Slytherin, when you can be brawny and brainless and a Gryffindor git?
And when I think how difficult his life was, alone, and completely isolated in the end...it makes me feel so very sad for him.
Argh. Instant tension headache. Feel sick. And will probably start leaking again after reading this. But you're right. It's a tragedy of Shakespearian proportions.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 01:11 pm (UTC)Yes. Oh, yes. I thought she might do it, but then it was just... there, and it shocked me.
I could have done without the epilogue, really.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 01:14 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 02:22 pm (UTC)Damn. You be smart, girl -- I didn't even think of it being that, I just found it odd that he'd do it. But this makes perfect, perfect sense.
Damn. Okay. Yes. Agree with much of what you said, plus am still sort of numb over Hedwig, mostly because that was the moment in the book when it turned real -- that anyone, anyone could die here.
So now I wonder who was the character Jo meant to kill but didn't, and the one she killed though she hadn't meant to? Bets on Hagrid/Lupin. Or somewhere thereabouts.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 03:28 pm (UTC)I read so fast I didn't really catch that moment, but you're right. And it's utterly heartbreaking.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 04:43 pm (UTC)Word, just word. His death i could take, the fact that it turned out to be pointless I could take, but that... & Harry was hardly even thinking about him! Agree with you too about the non-redemption of the Slytherins (& speaking of Slytherins, what about Slughorn? Why made someone as self-interested as him suddenly turn heroic?)
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 04:52 pm (UTC)That, and Ron with the Deliminator: "He knew you would want to come back..." Awwwww....::sniffle::
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 06:26 pm (UTC)The silver doe chapter is fantastic. Him destroying the Horcrux was just so blisteringly difficult, I was wincing through the whole thing.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 06:26 pm (UTC)"HE'S A MASS MURDERER!! AIGH! No, wait, he's my godfather! Hey, can we live together?"
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 06:27 pm (UTC)We really will need a lot of those. Poor Snupin!
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 06:28 pm (UTC)PS: I totally thought your awesome illustrated story was terrific, and I have to say, I prefer it to canon at this point...heh.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 06:56 pm (UTC)OTOH, lack of a funeral (and really, lack of any mention of a body beyond Harry seeing Snape *appear* to die) makes it easier for fanfic to make him not-dead.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:32 pm (UTC)Wait! Where did she say Grindelwald was dead? I thought he was "defeated." Though it would be in keeping with her inconsistent manners...
This really pissed me off, too. More character rape and Slytherin bashing, as if there isn't enough of the latter in the first 1-6 books. Enough. Who wants to be in Slytherin, when you can be brawny and brainless and a Gryffindor git?
Absolutely, totally, utterly enraging, isn't it? I am so pissed off about how completely she writes off Slytherin. It's basically the scapegoat of the whole series, and I just am very disheartened by this.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:33 pm (UTC)And the epilogue? That was pretty cheesy.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:34 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:36 pm (UTC)It tore me apart entirely. I just bawled after that; what an amazing moment it is.
Damn. Okay. Yes. Agree with much of what you said, plus am still sort of numb over Hedwig, mostly because that was the moment in the book when it turned real -- that anyone, anyone could die here.
I have a feeling that she didn't really need Hedwig for anything, and that's why she had no compunctions about killing her; also, it neatly paralleled the Fawkes sacrifice for Dumbledore in OotP.
So now I wonder who was the character Jo meant to kill but didn't, and the one she killed though she hadn't meant to? Bets on Hagrid/Lupin. Or somewhere thereabouts.
God, same here, I'm just really hoping she tells us! I have a feeling that Percy was granted the reprieve, for some reason.
And I keep thinking that Remus/Tonks might have been the two deaths she didn't plan.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:36 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:37 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:48 pm (UTC)& speaking of Slytherins, what about Slughorn? Why made someone as self-interested as him suddenly turn heroic?
HE IS A SEKRIT GRYFF TOO!!!!!!!11!!!!
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:53 pm (UTC)And Ron was just great in this book. I was SO happy that he got so much screentime, and that he wasn't just comic relief. Go Ron!
(no subject)
Date: 2007-07-21 07:54 pm (UTC)Two weeks from now I'll saying different things, but I think it's because right now I'm really into Snupin, and with Remus so irrevocably dead...it just doesn't seem to matter to me that Snape might not be.
I'm just angry that she didn't bother with even a funeral chapter or anything.